Pie and Tarts

Nov 28, 2005 | From the kitchen of Rose

Bruce Question:
I had been wanting to make a tart for some time, so I checked out your The Pie and Pastry Bible of the library again. I had never made a curd before nor the particular crust. I made the lime curd with kiwi. It turned out very very good. I took a couple of pieces to a neighbor.

I was wondering about a pineapple tart with oranges. It tastes good in my mind. I was wanting to know how to make a pineapple curd. I would use a fresh pineapple. Should the pineapple juice be reduced first? If so, how much? How much sugar should I use?

ps. I own your Cake Bible and I don't use mixes.

Thanks.

Rose Reply:
this is a very interesting idea. i think pineapple and orange would make a good combination. you could do a pineapple tart with orange curd to see how you like the flavors. if you want to experiment with pineapple curd, i would use the delicious golden pineapple for the juice and the same amount of sugar as the orange curd. pineapple juice has a lot of acidity so you probably don't need to reduce it. do let us know how it works!

Barry Question:
Dear Rose;
I can not begin to tell you how much I enjoy baking your recipes. I'm also the proud owner of all three of your "Bibles"

I do need your help though. I am consistantly running into the same problem with my pie doughs. For some reason my pie doughs are very crumbly and I'm having a very difficult time rolling the dough out. I measure accurately and use the correct flour for each of your recipes. Am I not kneading the dough enough? I'm afraid to make the dough to tough. Do you have any suggestions? I made your Tiramasu Black Bottom Tart the other day and I was just barely able to roll the dough. The edges of the dough were extremely crumbly.

Thank you in advance
Barry S.-an avid fan

Rose Reply:
thank you barry!
assuming you are using bleached all-purpose flour or pastry flour, (unbleached will be tougher and need more liquid) you might be using more flour than the recipe calls for if you are not weighing it. try using Wondra flour which is similar to pastry flour and will give you a more tender crust and also require less liquid. also, try replacing the water with heavy cream and add a teaspoon or 2 more if necessary. here's how you can tell:
the dough should be crumbly at first but hold together smoothly when kneaded lightly. if in doubt, take a small amount of the dough and knead it to see if it holds together.

the best way to knead the dough is to use latex gloves because the dough won't stick to them and you won't need to add more flour. a helpful technique in kneading is what the french call fraiser. using the heel of your hand, smear the dough forward onto the counter one or two times. this will cause any lumps of butter to form long sheets, resulting in flakiness. then use a bench scraper to gather up the dough and with your hands, press it together to form a disc.

J Question:
Hi - I tried making a "mile high lemon meringue pie" recipe that I found in Fine Cooking magazine. It has brown & white sugar in it. I made it twice and both times the meringue was totally raw when you cut into it. It called for jut browning the meringue under the broiler....I even turned the oven down to 325F. and letting the pie sit in the oven until the meringue turned a liht brown all obver and it still was raw in the middle. I threw away the entire pie after the 2nd attempt...what did I do wrong?

Rose Reply:
a high, deep meringue can take a long time to cook through.

my preference for meringue on a pie is to use italian meringue. the hot syrup cooks the egg white and keeps it from watering out later. i bake the pie at 350°F, then i put it under the broiler for about 20 seconds watching carefully so it doesn't burn. (see page 178 of the pie and pastry bible).

Lura Question:
why does my pecan pie always turn out "runny"?

Rose Reply:
it is the eggs that thicken the pie so if they're not heated enough the filling will become runny. overheating them will cause them to curdle. for this reason, i cook the filling first on the stove top as you would a lemon curd. my recipe will appear on every container of Lyle's golden refiners syrup starting in january. it is in the pie and pastry bible as well.

Rose Levy Beranbaum in reply to comment from royette padrid
12/01/2010 10:05 AM

royette, i'm so glad you like baking. you will find many innovative recipes both in my books and on this blog. do explore it!

Rose Levy Beranbaum in reply to comment from Shelley Porter
12/01/2010 10:03 AM

shelley, when you prick the crust it's important not to go all the way through to the pie plate. alternatively, after blind baking, you can press down the crust a few times with your fingertips until it is rigid enough to set without bubbilng up.

if a hole should develop fill it with a little raw egg white, return it to the oven for about 30 seconds until it becomes opaque and it will prevent the filling from going through it and sticking to the bottom.

royette padrid
12/01/2010 07:05 AM

dear rose i wish you have a recipe about inovative product not only in product also in process BECAUSE I LIKE BAKING

iam grade six student of BAY LAGUNA PHILIPNES

Shelley Porter
11/11/2010 06:03 AM

Hello - does anyone know how to avoid pecan pie (crust) sticking to the pie plate? The pie crust was prebaked a bit and pricked a few times with a fork. Thank you

Rose
11/23/2007 09:26 PM

jean, on the left side of the blog, just under search is categories. click on rose's books and it will lead you right to them on amazon!

Jean Miller
11/23/2007 04:03 PM

Where do I get the "Bibles" I keep running across in the comments? I think I'm in great need of those!!!

Thanks, again,
Jean

Jean Miller
11/23/2007 03:41 PM

I got some really helpful hints by reading the comments.

I need to get this meringue making down once and for all. Seems no matter what I do my meringue melts (after browning)and gets all runny as it cools, on the pie!!! Help!

Thanks,
Jean

Julie
11/21/2007 05:32 PM

Thanks Rose! I'm very excited about your recipe for The Best All American Apple Pie, which I found at The Splendid Table's Recipe Box. It's undergoing the final, completely assembled chilling right now, and the baking stone is preheating, even as I type...

Rose
11/21/2007 10:02 AM

i would leave it at cool room temperature uncovered so the crust doesn't get soggy from the filling and then if you can, reheat before serving.
happy tg to you as well!

Julie
11/21/2007 09:11 AM

Hi Rose -- I have a question about pie, but first let me just take the opportunity to thank you for sharing all your knowledge over the years. It simply wouldn't be holiday season for us without so many of your great recipes!

I'm making an apple pie (and a pumpkin pie, and a coffee-maple pecan pie) for Thanksgiving. I need to make the apple pie at least one day in advance (today, in fact!) and I want to know how best to store it overnight. Should I just let it cool and keep it in a plastic cake-keeper on the counter? Or does it need to be refrigerated and then re-heated before serving (which I'll probably do in any case)?

Thanks as always for your help -- and I hope you and all your blog readers have a glorious Thanksgiving holiday with loved ones...

Rose
11/19/2007 12:59 PM

wild turkey has long been one of my fav. bourbons though i now adore maker's mark. either will be just fine in the whipped cream.

Matthew
11/16/2007 12:40 PM

I'm thinking about making bourbon whipped cream to serve with your pecan pie. I thought it would cute to use Wild Turkey, but I understand that it is stronger than typical bourbon. Do you think it would be too strong in the whipped cream and/or should I use less?

Rose
10/01/2007 01:00 PM

luci, do a search for frozen pie on the blog--it's there in detail. so is convection but i'll tell you now that normally with convection you use 25F lower but in many counter top models which are not as powerful you use the same temperature and that you can only tell by trial and error.

Luci
09/30/2007 06:35 PM

My mother-in-law has a counter top convenction over. It is convenient for her to warm up left over pizza and foods for herself. She wants to bake a fozen pie in the convection oven but does not know how long or what temperature to bake in the convection oven. Do you have any tips or conversions that might be helpful? Do you need to thaw the pie first?

Patrincia
06/28/2007 10:08 PM

I purchased the lemons today. Tomorrow calls for rain, but I think Saturday is supposed to be fairly free of humidity. I'll report back.

Theresa
06/28/2007 01:58 PM

Can't wait!!! I hope it turns out great for you!

Patrincia
06/28/2007 01:36 PM

Theresa - I haven't made it yet, but I'm glad you reminded me. I think I'll do one this week!

Theresa
06/28/2007 12:51 PM

Patrincia or Lee - did you try making the Lemon Meringue pie yet with the revised instructions? If so, how did it come out? Report back, please! :)

Rose
06/15/2007 08:00 PM

i'm so glad bc this is one of the truly great american recipes and after perfecting it i was heart-broken that the copy editing error ruined it for everyone.

Lee in San Diego, CA
06/15/2007 07:33 PM

Thanks so much, Rose, for the clarification on the Lemon Meringue Pie recipe. I will definitely give it another try. The crust was nearly perfect and the Italian meringue was fabulous! Once I get the filling down (which should be easy now), it should be a terrific pie. I also appreciate all the corrections to my P&PB. Now I have an autographed AND annotated copy! :-)

Patrincia
06/15/2007 01:31 PM

Copy and paste - Easy! :)

Theresa
06/15/2007 12:31 PM

Thanks for spelling out the entry for us all, Patrincia!

Patrincia
06/15/2007 11:57 AM

Here it is:

Rose, I'm planning on making a chocolate oblivion tart. I was comparing the versions in the pie and cake bibles. I notice that you use the same amount of eggs in both, but 1/2 as much chocolate and butter for the tarts. The change is not mentioned in the understanding section, so I thought I would ask why the tart version has double the amount of eggs? Posted by: Matthew May 17, 2007 3:00 PM

please tell me what page number the chocolate oblivion tart is on as i sure can't find it! Posted by: Rose Levy Beranbaum May 17, 2007 6:45 PM

Rose, Cake Bible: 84, Pie Bible: 308.
Posted by: Matthew May 17, 2007 7:01 PM

thanks--you're right--mistake. you can tell by the weight of the total amount of filling which is 1 pound. if you added the 6 eggs it would be a lot more. so eggs should be 3/150 grams without shells. thanks! Posted by: Rose Levy Beranbaum May 17, 2007 7:43 PM

Matthew
06/15/2007 11:52 AM

You just have an extra period on the end--if you delete that it works.

Theresa
06/15/2007 11:43 AM

Well, I guess my link to the entry doesn't work - sorry!

Rose
06/15/2007 11:41 AM

thanks everyone! i'll put together a little errata page for the pie and pastry bible and i'll be sure to correct this in the next printing.

Theresa
06/15/2007 11:38 AM

Matthew - I found the posting you referenced on the Chocolate Oblivion tartlets (which you made as one large tart). Rose's response says "eggs should be 3/150 grams without shells" for the tartlets. Thanks so much! I'm sure I would not have picked up on this before making a delicious disaster. I have marked my book with the correct amount. Here's the link, if anyone wants to look at it: http://www.realbakingwithrose.com/2006/03/how_can_you_be_sure_your_oven.html. BTW, the picture link is not currently working in your posting. I'd be interested to see how the tart looked.

Patrincia
06/15/2007 11:32 AM

Theresa - let me know if you have success finding the Chocolate Oblivion Tartlet error (I did a quick search, but didn't hit it).

Theresa
06/15/2007 11:17 AM

Thanks, Matthew - that's a great idea about the egg white. I will check out the other glazes in the book, too. I think I might make the cookie crust with the whole egg (vs yolk and cream) and that should make it a little less delicate to start with. Perhaps it will make it less prone to sogginess. You're probably right about making the full recipe, too -- it's just that Rose makes it so easy to play around, since she gives the metric measurements. Then again, the leftovers are mighty good! Might need them for a "taste test"! Thanks for the tip about the Chocolate Oblivion tartlet error - I will search the blog.

Matthew
06/15/2007 10:43 AM

You should look at the other glazes on page 612. I often use Rose's technique of brushing egg-white on the just-baked crust to keep it cripsy. That is a good choice if you want something flavorless, but I think the chocolate would work too. If you do the Chocolate Oblivion tartlets, search this blog as I found an error in my edition of the PPB a few weeks back. Also I think the difference is closer to 90%, not 95%, but when it is that close, I would just make the full recipe and eat any leftovers if you have them.

Theresa
06/15/2007 10:25 AM

Rose, you are so helpful! And luckily, I have my P&PB with me today to write down the corrections. I am thinking of making the fresh berry tart (p 255) for this Sunday, either as a 9" tart or as tartlets. I am trying to avoid the glaze of preserves as all the preserves I looked at have citric acid in them and one of the guests has a citrus allergy. I notice that you say the glaze is optional on top but you recommend it for painting the bottom of the shells if you are not serving them immediately. I am wondering if I could paint the bottom with white chocolate instead, as you recommend in other recipes, or if that would throw off the balance of flavors. (Also, am I safe in assuming if I use the 9" pan, I should just use 95% of all the ingredients, as the recipe is written for a 9 1/2" pan, which I don't have.) If the white chocolate is not recommended, I may just go another direction - maybe the Chocolate Oblivion tartlets or the Burnt Almond Ice Cream tartlets. Thanks for all your wonderful recipes!!! (I can't wait for your new cookbook and the two coconut cakes in particular!)

Rose
06/15/2007 09:23 AM

there were very few corrections necessary in the pastry bible--i'll check the file when i go to nj in a few weeks, but almost all were corrected in the 5th printing except for page 560--the 2 cups of 1/2 and 1/2 weigh 17 ounces/484 grams.
an important one that was corrected is for the superlicious chocolate cream pie. on page 204 under "make the filling" it should read remaining 2 3/4 cups of milk.
by the way, for the lemon meringue, when i say boiling i mean boiling all over not just the edges of the filling!

Patrincia
06/15/2007 08:45 AM

Thank you Lee in San Diego!!! - For years I've told friends that I can make anything in the kitchen, except lemon meringue pie :(. My first 2 attempts resulted in soupy pies just like you described. Then, when I got The Pie and Pastry Bible I thought for sure I'd get it right, but sadly that pie didn't turn out any better. I've thought about it occasionally over the years, but my ego prevented me from ever trying again. Now it seems the mystery is solved. I can't wait to try again -Thanks!

All - Since we're on the subject, does anyone know if there is a list of Pie and Pastry Bible corrections somewhere?

Rose
06/15/2007 07:29 AM

you're absolutely right--the words after whisking constantly until boiling should be added. the cornstarch protects the yolks from curdling and they need to get that hot for the entire mixture the thicken.
it is best to use a heavy saucepan, not a double boiler, in order to reach this temperature.
i'm so sorry your first experience was such a bad one. i hope you will try again. it's one of my favorite recipes.

Lee in San Diego, CA
06/15/2007 02:59 AM

Rose,

I have your Pie and Pastry Bible. I have been intimidated about attempting any pies because my Mom used to bake the best pies and I am not confident I could live up to it. But finally at a friend's urging I tried your Lemon Meringue Pie with the Italian meringue.

My first try was an abject failure! The filling was absolutely liquid after I followed the directions to a T. So then I compared your recipe to the Betty Crocker cookbook and realized that your recipe has you (1) wisk a small amount of hot cornstarch mix into the egg yolks, (2) whisk the egg yolks into the remianing hot cornstarch mix, and (3) once it's mixed, remove it from the heat with no further cooking. Aren't you supposed to cook the yolks with the cornstarch mix for some time before you remove them from the heat? Where's the instruction for that?

Rose
03/18/2007 09:08 PM

do a search on the left in the search box for "high altitude."

joan gibbs
03/18/2007 07:35 PM

My cakes are always very, very crumbly......yet, they are moist. What am I doing wrong? I live at 7,500 feet above sea level.

Rose
11/25/2006 11:14 PM

obviously you have neither read my book nor this blog where i advised baking a frozen pie without defrosting it and the advantage this gives the crust. try doing a little research before you make announcements like this!

Grammarian2
11/25/2006 09:40 PM

I baked three beautiful pies recently. I prepared them a month ago for Thanksgiving dinner and froze them. My crusts are always very flaky and melt in your mouth. The bottom crust is every bit as flaky as the top. Never any problem, until I froze them before baking. A month later, I baked them the day before Thanksgiving, letting them thaw at room temperature first. Although the top crust look beautifully brown when I removed the pies from the oven, both the top crust and the bottom were soft and soggy. I will NEVER freeze an unbaked pie again. And although I have never frozen a baked pie, I don't think I'll take that gamble, either.

Cheers

Rose
11/22/2006 07:09 AM

p.s. if you don't have wondra flour in the uk use plain flour but cut it with about 10% self-raising cake flour and elminate the baking powder.

Rose
11/22/2006 07:06 AM

sorry--i never even heard of the intriguing sounding parsley "mash". in future please do a search on the blog and you may find the answer to your question. that's what i did and look what i turned up! (but if you do a search instead of the copy paste i did it will be organized in a chart and easier to read!

Rose's Favorite Flaky & Tender Pie Crust

INGREDIENTS

MEASUREMENTS

WEIGHT

cold

volume

ounces

grams

frozen unsalted butter, 1/2 inch cubes

8 tablespoons

4 ounces

113 grams

bleached all purpose flour, preferably Wondra

1-1/3 cups, sifted into the cup

6.5 ounces

184 grams

sea salt

1/8 teaspoon

baking powder (preferably Rumford or another non-aluminum variety)

cream cheese, cut into 4 pieces and chilled

1-3 ounce package

3 ounces

85 grams

heavy cream

2 tablespoons

cider vinegar

2 teaspoons

-
Food Processor Method

1) Process flour, salt, and baking powder to blend.
2) Add cream cheese and process until coarse.
3) Add butter cubes and pulse until peanut size.
4) Add cream and vinegar and pulse until butter is the size of small peas.
5) Scrape dough onto a lightly floured work surface. Use latex gloves or cover hands with plastic bags and press dough until it holds together in one smooth flat disc.
6) Wrap, and refrigerate 45 minutes before rolling.

Note: Baking powder containing aluminum has a bitter flavor. Most health food stores and many supermarkets carry the calcium variety.You can eliminate the baking powder and double the salt but the crust will be less tender.

keith
11/21/2006 11:24 AM

Hello Rose,

Please can you help!

I don`t know if you have heard of pie mash & Liquor(parsley sauce), but in East & South London this dish was sold in dedicated shops along with eels, its been a main stay for the cockney folk since victorian times, and is a closely guarded secret.

I can make the rest including the pie filling.

My question is: Do you have a recipe for the pie pastry?

Rose
10/19/2006 07:33 AM

not if the oven bakes evenly. the fan helps but not all convection oven are created equal so it really depends on your oven.

mary
10/19/2006 05:03 AM

Hello Rose,
When baking 2 trays of meringues in a fan assisted oven is it neccessary to swap the trays around during baking??
Thank you!

Rose
08/02/2006 12:47 PM

have you tried mine from the pie and pastry bible? i was very happy with it. part of what i like is that i don't put it on at the beginning so it doesn't burn. please check this out.

Phyllida
08/02/2006 12:37 PM

I have tried numerous recipes for crumb topping for pies using varying amounts of flour, sugar(white and/or brown) and butter, and some using oatmeal, and even one calling for baking powder. All of them melt into the filling, making the pie too sweet and looking terrible. Can you suggest an infallible recipe and technique? Many thanks for all I have learned from you.

Rose
05/29/2006 10:19 AM

i'm not familiar with the cornell brand oven but in general, both the upper and lower elements of an oven should be on for cake baking. the cake should be placed on a rack set in the lower third of the oven. and if it is convection, i.e. a fan is blowing, you need to lower the temperature by 25 degrees fahrenheit. normally cakes bake at 350 degrees F. i'm not in a location now where i can give you the conversion to celcius so please check this out.

Bhlwir Kaur
05/25/2006 08:35 AM

Hi, I have a problem with baking cakes. I am not sure how to adjust the temperature in the "Cornell" brand oven when baking cakes.
Should I use the upper and the lower heat when baking cakes. The oven has fans to circulate the heat. The fan is placed at the back of the oven.
The temperature. Should it be 180 degress Celcius or 160 degress Celcius when baking the cake?

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Welcome to Real Baking with Rose, the personal blog of author Rose Levy Beranbaum.

Spend A Moment with Rose, in this video portrait by Ben Fink.

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Hector's Take on Rose's Cakes

Pie and Tarts