Im so so sorry to bother you again!! but i tried making ganache.. lets just say i dint plan ahead. i realised when the carmel was bubblign that my butter wasnt at room temp, so i quickly put it out. also i went through the ganache proportions like u said and i figured instead of 1/2 cup and 2 and 1/2 TBSP OF cream maybe i would need that plus 4 TBSP more. does that make any sense rose? please help , im so hopeless at this!!! anyway so my htermometer moved up and down and jumped out of the pan a couple o times when i was doign somethin on the counter nearby ( i have a small kitchen) and then there was a lot of sugar candy that had collected at the tip, i dont know if thats the reason but my caramel mix turned really really relly dark and started smoking!!!! much before it turned anywhere near the 188C MARK....it looks really really dark and it dint smell candyish anymore, started smellin horribly burnt, so i addded the cream and folowed on, but in the end when i tasted it , it tasted bitter and had this grainy texture, i gather this is cause of the temp diff, it was at that point i realised not only ws my buttr cols but so was my cream.sigh anyway... now i ve put everything out again to try again when my cream and sugar are at room temp, i so hope u reply soon! and im so so SO SORRY about the gargantuan post!

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hey rose, i need to make the midnight ganache and the only chocolate i can find is lindt excellence 65 % or lindt fine 45 %. Will it be fine if i go with 45 % ? im afraid if i go wit hthe 65 it will be too dark...what say?

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Sherrie, to update your question with info from the forums, remelt ganache to about 115-120F. Anything over 120F and you risk the ganache breaking (cocoa butter separating).

You're right about chilling, you can start whipping around 68-70F, some are using a colder temp, 40 or 50F, depending on the recipe.

Whip just to soft peaks and then let the ganache sit at cool room temp for a few minutes, it will firm up nicely.

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if it happens for light whipped ganache, you can reheat/remelt/recool

if it happens for dark unwhipped ganache, I hae no idea since I have never done so. btw, I have this batch in my fridge now for this sunday, and I am getting scared if it seizes or clums.

a side note I want to share is how wonderful my little induction stove is performing. the temperature control is recise and very even. I have heated cream from frozen without stirring! Also, I have heated and reheated sugar for caramel without needing to transfer to a pyrex to stop the heating. the ultimate test will be to melt chocolate w/o loosing its temper!

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Barbara, you're right about adding enough water that it is no longer sensitive to seizing. It's in the Cake Bible and Rose uses Shirley Corriher's explanation of a drop of water in sugar where it clumps and hardens and adding enough water that the sugar doesn't harden. I am writing this from memory and cannot for the life of me find it in TCB right now.
I have never had ganache seize so can't really comment on that.

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I wonder... I believe I had a batch of ganache seize once. I had two batches cooling in the fridge and the first batch I tried to whip had condensation on it's surface... it seized immediately when I started to whip it. I was able to blot all the condensation off the second batch before whipping and it didn't seize. I suppose the first batch could have seized because of another reason, but I always attributed it to the condensation.

I welcome comments from anyone else on the subject - I'd be curios to hear what others have experienced.

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Patrincia, the quote you give is very true about pure chocolate. From what I've read (and I'm sure Rose has written about this somewhere), pure melted chocolate is very sensitive to water. But once you add enough water (or cream), it is no longer sensitive to seizing, if I understand correctly. As Julie says, the chocolate/cream mixture can still separate if overheated (I'm sorry to say that I did this once).

Can ganache seize if you add the hot cream too slowly? I always dump it in fast and have never been willing to waste chocolate by experimenting.

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From Rose's book A Passion for Chocolate:

(when melting chocolate)
"Water, even a drop in the form of steam, must never touch the chocolate or "seizing" will occur. If this should occur, add fat, 1 tablespoon at a time, such as vegetable shortening, clarified butter, or cocoa butter, to help restore fluidity.

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Sherrie, to remelt the ganache, you should only go as hot as you need to in order to liquefy- overheating will cause the cocoa butter to separate. Do not stir too much or try to whip while warm or at room temp. After melting, the mixture muxt be completely chilled (40F) before rewhipping. Stop at soft peaks if that will help you avoid overwhipping. With this much cream (light whipped ganache), a drop or two of water shouldn't cause seizing.

Good Luck!

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I'm thinking you might have inadvertently incorporated some water/moisture into the ganache, which could make your chocolate seize. It might be best to start over with a fresh batch.

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I need to clarify...how warm/hot should I reheat the ganache?

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It is my annual pleasure to make the Triple Chocolate Cake for our Christmas gathering...but again I am having difficulty getting the Light Whipped Ganache right. I know that overbeating (my enemy) causes grainiess, but when I melt the ganache to start anew, it appears grainy as well (I do this in a double boiler or short intervals in the microwave). I am not sure if the graininess is due to air already encorporated into the ganache, or if I am having separation of the fats. When I rewhip (at 68 F) it still looks grainy. What temperature should the ganache be following remelting??

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Thank you Patricia, Annie, Matthew, Jeannette and Cathy. You're right the cake did taste wonderful and as an added bonus our entire house smelled of chocolate. I also had chocolate covered countertops from making the chocolate curls.

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I've found that if you wrap your ganache the same way as you do for royal icing that works very well for refrigerating/freezing for future use! You just have to use a couple layers of cling wrap and make sure that you wipe the outside of the bowl to make sure it sticks real well and then push the plastic wrap into the ganache all around the perimeter so no air ie condensation can get through. Sometimes I encase the entire bowl in a glad freezer bag too and seal it again for an added barrier. If you use a bowl/container that the cling wrap doesn't stick to use a tight fitting rubber band if you can find one. This seems to work for me! Hope it helps the rest of you too!

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I love it Rozanne! Gorgeous!!

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Beautiful, such clever people on this site!

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Rozanne, what a beautiful cake! It is stunning!

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It's fabulous, Rozanne and I'm sure it tasted yummy. I really enjoyed looking at your other cakes too. Thanks for the tip about the cones, Rose. I often have trouble judging where to cut them but this makes it almost foolproof.

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Great photo Rozanne - the cake looks absolutely wonderful. I bet it tasted amazing!

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Thank you for the compliment Rose. It means the world to me.

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Here's what I ended up doing for my cousin's b'day cake.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gianduja/2527860783/

I tried to do the chocolate lattice band but accidentally cut the tip of the parchment cone too big. Oh well.......everyone still loved the cake, specially the taste.

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Thanks Annie. I ended up making the Milk Choc. Buttercream. The taste and texture is awesome. As Rose mentions in the book, it is like eating your favourite milk choc. bar melted. I used Lindt.

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Rozanne, in that case I would definitely make Rose's Milk Chocolate Buttercream. It's just chocolate (mostly milk choc) and butter and is the creamiest chocolate filling you would wish for. I frequently make the Chocolate Spike Cake (TCB pp198) and this frosting is always a winner.

A good milk chocolate that should be available from Whole Foods is from Callebaut. They break the big 5kg blocks up for retail sale - or at least they used to when I lived in the States three years ago. Green and Blacks is another good milk chocolate or even Cadbury's if you can find it. I don't use Hershey's as I find it very grainy. If you want to spend extra go for Valrhona.

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Annie, I need it for the filling and the outside. I usually use Rose's dark choc. ganache or the choc. mousseline. I'm making the cake for my cousin and he likes only milk chocolate so I thought I would do a milk choc. ganache for him.
Barbara, thanks for the link. I'll check it out.

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I think I recall seeing a milk chocolate ganache somewhere in the recipes on Nick Malgieri's Web site -- www.nickmalgieri.com/recipes -- have to run off to eat dinner now so no time to verify if my (increasingly unreliable) memory is correct. I'm sure you'll enjoy looking at his recipes in any case!

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Rozanne, do you want the ganache for coating or as filling/truffles? I have a few recipes for milk chocolate truffles but I use Rose's Milk Choc Buttercream (TCB pp250) for filling and coating cakes and it's simply divine.

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Does anyone have a good recipe for milk chocolate ganache? There isn't one in the Cake Bible except for the Burnt Almond one and since Hershey's doesn't make it anymore I'm not sure what other brand of milk chocolate to use considering every brand differs in terms of sugar and cocoa butter content. Thanks.

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I thought of that too, Patricia, and was very careful about not overmixing this last time. I will keep trying when I get the time and this time will try the whisk attachment. Maybe that's the ticket!

Thank you!

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I don't have my cake bible in front of me at the moment, but isn't there a warning about how overmixing can cause curdling in buttercream or ganache? (I think that's right, but I can't remember which)

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Cathy, I use the Lindt white chocolate for my ganache and have never had a problem. So I don't think it is the chocolate that is causing the problem. I think the whisk attachment will definitely make a difference although I cannot think of why it is grainy. Maybe Rose will be able to help you out.

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I've made the traditional chocolate version of the mousseline, but I haven't done the white chocolate version, but I'm sure it's similar.

I haven't made the Creme Ivoire Deluxe either, but Rose's description of it makes me wonder why I haven't. Will have to put that one on my baking to do list.

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Thanks Patricia, I think I might. Is the consistency of the Creme Ivoire the same as mousseline?

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Cathy - there is also a white chocolate mousseline variation.

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Cathy - why don't you try the "Creme Ivoire Deluxe" buttercream recipe instead? (page 246)

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Thank you, Patricia. It is so fantastic to have it! Yes, making Mousseline Buttercream is not 1/2 the production it used to be.

And now I would love to be able to make the white ganache in the same way. Just wonder if using the whisk attachment for the ganache will make a difference....?

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Cathy - Congratulations on your new toy - I know you'll love it for years and years. In the past when we've moved, the movers always ask if there are any special items that shouldn't be packed... I always say, "Don't touch the KitchenAid" :).

Wow, I can't believe you were making the buttercream with a hand mixer, and I can't believe your hand mixer didn't go on strike! I don't know if that was the cause of your buttercream problems, but it's definitely possible. I think you'll notice a huge difference in how much easier the new KitchenAid will be for you. My baking changed dramatically when I bought a KitchenAid (it's so helpful to have the right equipment).

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I'm using Manufacturing Cream from Smart & Final.

I just got my new Kitchen Aid Professional 600, and can't believe how wonderful it is! I just realized that b/c I didn't have a whip attachment for my hand mixer, I just used the regular beaters when I did the white choc ganaches. Do you think it may be a matter of the whip attachment vs. the regular beaters?

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Cathy - when I'm mixing the heavy cream, I do so until the whip attachment leaves a defined trail in the cream. What kind of cream are you using?

Any advice here Rose?

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Okay, I know something is wrong then. It is either something I'm doing or my white choc (Lindt)is still not good enough.

Maybe you can help me, Patricia? When Rose says to mix until "traces of beater marks just begin to show distinctly," does she mean while the beaters are beating? Does she mean when stopped, there are marks around the beaters?...I hate being so persnickety, but I would love to figure out what I may be doing wrong. I may be putting the cooled, melted white chocolate in too early or too late.

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Smooth, silky, and oh soooo delicious!

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That's a good tip about the paper towel. What should that white ganache look like when first made? Should it be smooth and silky at first?

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Oh Cathy - the batch that I reheated didn't smooth our perfectly, but it was better than being totally grainy. When I reheated it, I smoothed it with an immersion blender because the food processor bowl was already in the sink and I didn't have time to wash/dry. Anyway, hope it works out for you.

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Hi Cathy - What I do now is place the cold bowl of cold ganache on the counter and immediately place a paper towel or two on the surface of the cold ganache. The paper towel absorbs the condensation and peels right off once the ganache is room temp.

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I think you're right, Patricia. How best do you bring it to room temp then?

I will try to reheat and see what happens. Hopefully I can save it!

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Cathy - I experienced a similar problem with dark chocolate ganache that I had stored in the refrigerator. When placed the bowl of cold ganache on the counter to come to room temp, condensation formed on the ganache's surface. When that moisture was stirred into the batch of ganache, the whole bowl seized (became grainy). I was able to reheat it all and start again, but I'm quite sure the condensation was the reason why my ganache seized.

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Okay. I made the white ganache once again using Lindt white choc. It started to look a tad grainy and I stopped mixing. It seemed okay in texture but not smooth and satiny like the Sour Cream Ganache had been.

Then I froze it for a few days until i was ready to work with it. When I thawed it today and stirred, the grainy texture seemed to get worse. So much so now that I'm not sure I can even use it.

My question is this....what is the texture suppose to look/be like for the white ganache?

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Worth a road trip indeed!

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I didn't know they had white choc too. Great! Yes, what I saw was the huge chunks and blocks. I love that place--worth any road trip!

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Thanks Cathy - I've only purchased their dark chocolate in the tin (for your purse), it was fabulous, but you'd go broke if you baked a cake using a gazillion little tins of chocolate. They also sell huge blocks (11 lbs I think), and smaller chunks of the huge blocks for a more affordable price (they have white, milk, and dark to choose from). I haven't purchased any yet because I have quite a chocolate supply already, but I may just have to get some anyway - my curiosity is killing me. Our closest Trader Joe's is over an hour away, so I don't get there very often - I guess it's time for a road trip!

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Great! Sour Cream Ganache can march on in a pinch! Thanks Rose.

Patricia, actually I have not. I just saw it in the store a few days ago but didn't buy it yet. I will now, though and get back to you. I'm not a big chocolate person, but I have heard from good sources (friends who are!) that their chocolate is extremely good. The amount you get for the money is very good too.

I'll let you know!

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Oh Cathy - I've been waiting for someone to post about Trader Joe's chocolate. Have you eaten any by itself? How does the flavor/texture compare to higher quality national brands?

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Thanks Rose & Rozanne. I will look for Lindt.

Rose, are you saying that aside from the Sour Cream Ganache, when you use 60 % to 62% chocolate, you add that amount of sugar?

I found a 54% Bittersweet at Trader Joes the other day--would this be satisfactory? Would that one percent still mess up my Sour Cream Ganache? (cracking and bitter)

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Cathy, I use Lindt white chocolate. I also use Lindt Excellence Madagascar 65% cocoa chocolate or the Ghirardelli 60% bittersweet chocolate chips. I have not tried the Green and Black's chocolate as yet. I have tried the Green and Black's cocoa powder though b/c Rose recommended it and it is absolutely wonderful.
Rozanne

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Thank you Rose and Rozanne. Yes, it looks like from Ghirdelli's site, their dark chocolate has 60% cacao. Can I ask what brand of bittersweet choc you use?

I'm wondering if it is the white choc itself. The temp was completely cool when I added it. I know you suggest Green & Black or Valrhona ivoire, Rose, but I didn't have time to have it shipped. What kind do you use, Rozanne?
I would love to find some locally (So Cal) so I could get some in a pinch.

I appreciate all your help. I feel like I have 50 questions every minute...I have found myself (happily) in the middle of an evolving home cake design business, and am trying to stay ahead of my next order.

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Cathy, did you let the chocolate/ cream mixture cool completely before you added it to the cream and were the cream, bowl and beaters chilled? I think the temperature is crucial to the success of the ganache. I have made it several times and it has always turned out well. Give it another try, it is worth the effort b/c it can be used in many number of ways.
Maybe Rose will be able to help you out better.
Rozanne

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I had some problems with 2 of the ganaches yesterday--Sour Cream and White Ganache.

I used Ghirardeli Bittersweet and White chocolate in the recipes. I thought it safe to use their White Choc b/c it contains cocoa butter. About the bittersweet, your Sour Cream Ganache recipe warns to use a choc with no more than 53% choc mass or it will taste bitter. I couldn't find this on the label or their web site. Is choc mass the same as the term cacao?

The Sour Cream Ganache (on Cordon Rose Banana Cake--excellent) turned out well in that it spread beautifully, but once it sat out at room temp for an hour or so, it cracked along the top, side edges. Do you know why this may have happened? Is there anything I can do to prevent?

The White Ganache didn't even get off the ground--or shall I say out-of-the-bowl! I added it to the cream and was beating with mixer just until stiff peaks began. It never happened, so I kept beating. Then it started separating and became gloppy & clumpy. Since I didn't seem to have much to lose, I went ahead and kept beating. Finally it became the consistency of homemade ice cream. My intention was to experiment/create a Resses filling with it that I can use in butter cakes. But I'm not sure I trust it to hold up now. I wanted to try to have this filling for a cake to be picked up on Monday.

It doesn't say to do this in this particular recipe, but should I have done the White Ganache in the food processor? Can you tell me what went wrong?

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Thank you Rose.

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Rose, I am planning on making your Dark Chocolate Ganache but flavoured with orange zest. Have you tried this and if so how much zest did you use? I have made the ganache a million times before but thought I'll give it a different flavour this time. It's for a bridal shower cake.
Thank you
Rozanne

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thanks for the advice re the eggs. I'll look for pasteurized whites.

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I have used pasteurized egg whites for the buttercream and it works beautifully.

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I love the mousseline buttercream, and so does everyone that I make it for, but I was wondering about the egg whites. since they are technically uncooked (right?), is there a risk for salmonella? or does the sugar syrup raise the temp of the egg white to 160? i would like to use it for a baby shower, but am concerned for the mom-to-be... thanks so much!

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thanks for the temperatures! I was wondering about that as well. I had no problem making the regular ganache, but my light whipped ganache curdled. I tried remelting, cooling, and rebeating, but to no avail. i ended up throwing it away and making chocolate mousseline buttercream instead (which was a little too sweet for my taste buds...) If I want to use the light whipped gananche as a filling for a cake, does the cake have to stay in the fridge? thanks!

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Thanks so much! I'll copy it right into the book tonight!

Jennifer

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I am having the same trouble with the ganache. What is the temp you heat the cream to? What is temp to whip at? You give bake times and temps, weights and measures for everything else, how about these temperatures, since they seem to be critical to success!

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Is anyone familiar with Perkins peanut butter pie? There is a layer of creamy, fudgy chocolate on the bottom. I think this may be ganache but not sure.. Does anyone know if this is ganache or know if ganache would work?

Thanks

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