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Urgent help w/ moussline
Posted: 25 August 2009 02:00 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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Sorry to take a day to respond, Brian. A little tired after finishing the wedding cake I did this weekend. But I breathe a sigh of relief with you, after reading your edit-added note. Yes, it is a narrow temp window—but it really works. I found out to my dismay Saturday when, through impatience, I curdled the bc destined for my 12” tier. Started rebeating when bc was around 63F. Broke down completely—the bc, not the baker! haha Unable to recover it. Had to make a new batch.

I think the problem for me is that the bc looks like it’s getting in trouble as the temp heads up into 65-70. It’s so tempting to beat too soon. At the other end of the window, it also looks thin but won’t come together.

Another issue can be the syrup, both the temp and getting most/all if possible into the egg whites. Jeanne’s suggestions worked well for me—finding the “sweet spot” and pouring directly into the egg whites once it’s reached 248F. Yet I’ve lost lots to the measuring cup in the past, and the bc still worked.

Are you using curd in your bc? I’d be tempted to leave out the Limoncello in that case. Could it be the problem? I say that only because the curd is a tried and tested addition to Rose’s mousseline. But maybe I’m grasping at straws.  confused

The only other advice I have for you right now is that if you have to chill the bc during piping because of the heat, give it a stir every now and then to equalize the temp changes throughout. An over-precaution perhaps, but easy enough to do if you’re checking the temp anyway. I wish you all kinds of luck. You’re a brave man to take this on for your own wedding!

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Posted: 25 August 2009 05:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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Carolita - 25 August 2009 05:00 PM

Sorry to take a day to respond, Brian. A little tired after finishing the wedding cake I did this weekend. But I breathe a sigh of relief with you, after reading your edit-added note. Yes, it is a narrow temp window—but it really works. I found out to my dismay Saturday when, through impatience, I curdled the bc destined for my 12” tier. Started rebeating when bc was around 63F. Broke down completely—the bc, not the baker! haha Unable to recover it. Had to make a new batch.

I think the problem for me is that the bc looks like it’s getting in trouble as the temp heads up into 65-70. It’s so tempting to beat too soon. At the other end of the window, it also looks thin but won’t come together.

Another issue can be the syrup, both the temp and getting most/all if possible into the egg whites. Jeanne’s suggestions worked well for me—finding the “sweet spot” and pouring directly into the egg whites once it’s reached 248F. Yet I’ve lost lots to the measuring cup in the past, and the bc still worked.

Are you using curd in your bc? I’d be tempted to leave out the Limoncello in that case. Could it be the problem? I say that only because the curd is a tried and tested addition to Rose’s mousseline. But maybe I’m grasping at straws.  confused

The only other advice I have for you right now is that if you have to chill the bc during piping because of the heat, give it a stir every now and then to equalize the temp changes throughout. An over-precaution perhaps, but easy enough to do if you’re checking the temp anyway. I wish you all kinds of luck. You’re a brave man to take this on for your own wedding!

So many questions, but I think yesterday’s batch may become an emergency backup frosting batch…

So is the sliding on the bowl curdling?  It had seemed like it was sliding on a thin coat of liquid on the side of the bowl in one massive lump when initially transferring to a Gladware container. (expecting it to cling and require scraping rather than slide)  And it would happen on the addition of the limoncello so I had just thought it was some trouble in incorporating that into the buttercream.  I added the curd after the liqueur.

The buttercream itself seems okay and being the slightly pessimistic person that I am sometimes, I see one non-ideal thing as the beginning stages of irrecoverable buttercream.  Anyone have photos of the steps of the buttercream or maybe the early stages of curdling so I have something to compare against?  Wish I had photos of the issues from last night. 

I think I’m also going to buy a couple new instant read thermometers. (the CDN ones mentioned in this thread) because the syrup stage for me is difficult since the side mounted one I have barely reaches the syrup. (I have a couple tricks to get the bulb into the syrup).  I need to also only do the buttercream in the kitchen because apparently the ventilation in there is horrible and if anything is done in the oven, the entire kitchen jumps up a lot. (no central AC), so perhaps that was another one of my problems.

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Posted: 25 August 2009 06:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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No, the slopping, slip-sliding around in the bowl in one big smooth lump floating on a film of liqueur is not what you see at the beginning of curdling. In my case, when that happened, it seemed that the mousseline was just getting too warm to happily accept the Limoncello. Like you, I added the liqueur first and planned to add the curd next. Tucking the bc in our walk-in cooler worked, as I described in previous post. I left my thermometer right in the bowl. Periodiodically checked the temp and stirred the glop to equalize temp. It took a surprising amount of time to get in the right temperature range. But when it did,  the bc accepted the liqueur. I alternated mixer speed a couple of times, kicking it up a notch and then back down again. That seemed to help. Then I added the curd.

Have you ever made cookies where you creamed the eggs and sugar too long, and it started to look a little shiny and lumpy? That’s sort of the look of bc starting to curdle. Or if you’ve seen small curd cottage cheese, picture that—only super small, shiny and yellow—and the liquid all separating out. Eww, it gives me goose bumps, because it brings back what happened Saturday with that 4 cups I could ill afford to lose!! But don’t worry, Brian. You’re doing great, and that won’t happen to you.

Sounds like you’re using a glass candy thermometer? You’ll find the syrup SO much easier with the instant read. Go get it, right now! smile

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Posted: 27 August 2009 12:23 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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Carolita - 25 August 2009 09:25 PM

No, the slopping, slip-sliding around in the bowl in one big smooth lump floating on a film of liqueur is not what you see at the beginning of curdling. In my case, when that happened, it seemed that the mousseline was just getting too warm to happily accept the Limoncello. Like you, I added the liqueur first and planned to add the curd next. Tucking the bc in our walk-in cooler worked, as I described in previous post. I left my thermometer right in the bowl. Periodiodically checked the temp and stirred the glop to equalize temp. It took a surprising amount of time to get in the right temperature range. But when it did,  the bc accepted the liqueur. I alternated mixer speed a couple of times, kicking it up a notch and then back down again. That seemed to help. Then I added the curd.

Have you ever made cookies where you creamed the eggs and sugar too long, and it started to look a little shiny and lumpy? That’s sort of the look of bc starting to curdle. Or if you’ve seen small curd cottage cheese, picture that—only super small, shiny and yellow—and the liquid all separating out. Eww, it gives me goose bumps, because it brings back what happened Saturday with that 4 cups I could ill afford to lose!! But don’t worry, Brian. You’re doing great, and that won’t happen to you.

Sounds like you’re using a glass candy thermometer? You’ll find the syrup SO much easier with the instant read. Go get it, right now! smile

I went out and got an instant read thermometer.  BB&B didn’t have the exact one I wanted but the one I bought is much better than the glass thermometer.  I took out one of the cupcakes that I was able to pipe from the batch of mousseline that was giving me slight issue.  The room was fairly warm and 4 hours later it still held the shape of the piping, looked slighly glossy and was extremely creamy/smooth.  I’m guessing 4 hours was a bit much (I meant to check it in 2, but had to run out).  I’m going to guess though that I may have had some sugar temperature issues as well.  I’m also going to do a search to see this trick about skipping the glass jar.  I’m intrigued and looking forward to doing that.

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Posted: 27 August 2009 12:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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Jeanne described in a couple of places how she pours the syrup right into the meringue. One is in the “buttercream tutorial” thread. Lots of good advice in there from other folks, too.
http://www.realbakingwithrose.com/index_ee.php/forums/viewthread/764/

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