Kneading time so much longer than the recipe calls for. Please help.
Posted: 05 March 2011 11:12 PM   [ Ignore ]
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  34
Joined  2008-04-10

Hi everyone,

I’m fairly new to baking bread. I’ve been using a scale and measuring meticulously in grams. But every time I make one of Rose’s breads, the dough doesn’t come together in the time that the instructions says it should. I always find I have to add more flour. I use Gold Medal unbleached all-purpose just like the recipes call for, so I don’t understand. Should I decrease the liquid? Should I increase the flour? Should I just keep mixing and cross my fingers and hope that the dough will eventually come together? Please help.

Rod

Profile
 
 
Posted: 06 March 2011 12:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
Sr. Member
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  1352
Joined  2008-09-27
Roddy - 06 March 2011 03:12 AM

Hi everyone,

I’m fairly new to baking bread. I’ve been using a scale and measuring meticulously in grams. But every time I make one of Rose’s breads, the dough doesn’t come together in the time that the instructions says it should. I always find I have to add more flour. I use Gold Medal unbleached all-purpose just like the recipes call for, so I don’t understand. Should I decrease the liquid? Should I increase the flour? Should I just keep mixing and cross my fingers and hope that the dough will eventually come together? Please help.

Rod

Some more details would be helpful.  What recipes have you tried?  How much longer does it take you for the dough to come together?  What mixer do you have and what setting are you using?

 Signature 

If error is corrected whenever it is recognized as such, the path of error is the path of truth.

—Hans Reichenbach

Profile
 
 
Posted: 06 March 2011 01:06 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  34
Joined  2008-04-10

Well, I made the potato sandwich loaf recently for example. I use a kitchen aid professional level 4 like the recipe says to use. I used the potato flour substition instructions on page 269. I mixed for like 30 minutes and it didn’t clear the bowl, so I finally had to add more flour, which I don’t mind doing, but my question is this, at what point do I add more flour, how much at a time, and how long do I mix before adding more flour? Or should I just start off with less water to begin with? This isn’t the only bread that this happens with, either, unfortunately. So I don’t know if Gold Medal just has less protein content and requires more flour to absorb the specified amount of water.

I’m kind of a perfectionist, so I guess it’s frustrating because I like to be able to put in the exact ingredients, mix for the specified amount of time, and have the dough turn out smooth, shiny, and tacky like the instructions says without having to add more flour.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 06 March 2011 01:17 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
Sr. Member
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  1352
Joined  2008-09-27
Roddy - 06 March 2011 05:06 AM

I’m kind of a perfectionist, so I guess it’s frustrating because I like to be able to put in the exact ingredients, mix for the specified amount of time, and have the dough turn out smooth, shiny, and tacky like the instructions says without having to add more flour.

Well, yes, I’d like that too, but it doesn’t always work out that way.  grin  Still, 30 minutes is way too long.  Most doughs should come together in under 10.  One possible reason is that the dough hook isn’t grabbing onto the dough early in its mixing; many people start out on the paddle and only switch to the dough hook once a rough ball is formed.  Looking at Rose’s recipe for the Potato Sandwich Loaf, though, she doesn’t say that the dough is expected to clear the sides of the bowl.  She mentions using an oiled spatula for scraping down the dough clinging to the sides.  Another thing many people do is withhold some amount of the water and add it slowly as the dough comes together.  Still, this dough is only 63% hydration, so it should come together pretty easily.  You are allowing the 20 minutes rest, aren’t you?

 Signature 

If error is corrected whenever it is recognized as such, the path of error is the path of truth.

—Hans Reichenbach

Profile
 
 
Posted: 06 March 2011 01:27 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  34
Joined  2008-04-10

Yes, I’m allowing the 20 minute rest.

Maybe I’m not mixing it enough before letting it rest. I’m not sure what it means exactly to “form a rough dough” before letting it rest.

How much water do you think I should withhold to start off with?

Maybe it shouldn’t clear the bowl, but even after 30 minutes the dough is still pooling at the bottom of the bowl.

I will try using the paddle next time first.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 06 March 2011 01:39 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
Sr. Member
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  1352
Joined  2008-09-27
Roddy - 06 March 2011 05:27 AM

Maybe it shouldn’t clear the bowl, but even after 30 minutes the dough is still pooling at the bottom of the bowl.

I will try using the paddle next time first.


Hmmm, “pooling” sounds very wet.  Although the amount of water you need may vary a bit from the recipe, it shouldn’t be more than a couple of teaspoons.  How much flour have you been adding?  It’s best not to add flour if you don’t have to, because it throws all the other ingredient ratios off.  If your dough truly is very, very wet, you might try holding back a 1/4 cup or so; perhaps you’re introducing some other source of moisture that we can’t see yet.

 Signature 

If error is corrected whenever it is recognized as such, the path of error is the path of truth.

—Hans Reichenbach

Profile
 
 
Posted: 06 March 2011 01:48 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  34
Joined  2008-04-10

Thanks for your help, Richard. I’m going to withhold 1/4 cup on this recipe and try again. I’ll take some pictures along the way so you can see what’s going on. Maybe that will give you more of an idea of what I’m doing wrong.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 06 March 2011 01:52 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
Sr. Member
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  1352
Joined  2008-09-27
Roddy - 06 March 2011 05:48 AM

I’ll take some pictures along the way so you can see what’s going on. Maybe that will give you more of an idea of what I’m doing wrong.

Great idea!  I almost suggested that.

 Signature 

If error is corrected whenever it is recognized as such, the path of error is the path of truth.

—Hans Reichenbach

Profile
 
 
Posted: 06 March 2011 01:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  34
Joined  2008-04-10

I called you Richard. Sorry, Charles.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 06 March 2011 01:49 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  632
Joined  2008-01-24

When I knead in the machine I reserve about 1/4 cup of the flour. On the first scrape down I add the flour between the dough and the bowl to keep it from sticking to the bowl. This allows the dough to cling to the dough hook and knead properly. If the dough hook is just stirring the dough will not develop, as you have discovered. I dribble small amounts of flour around the dough ball as kneaded. smile

 Signature 

“This pizza is a symphony of flavors”

Profile
 
 
   
  Back to top