Cupcake liners peeling
Posted: 06 September 2008 01:55 AM   [ Ignore ]
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Hi everyone

For years I have been using Rose’s White Velvet Cake recipe for not only my vanilla cake, but my lemon as well (simply add some lemon zest and a touch of lemon juice).  Both have always been popular and I often make them in cupcake form.  HOwever more and more often now the liners of the lemon cupcakes peel away as they start to cool when coming from the oven.
I’ve tried a variety of different cupcake liners, I’ve tried different pans, I’ve even split the recipe in 1/2 baked 1/2 vanilla and 1/2 lemon in the same oven and the same liners for the same amount of time yet the lemon ones peel.  This does not “always” occur, but it occurs more often then not and I cannot have that continue to happen. 
Today I just baked lemon ones yet again - they were beautiful in the oven, but as soon as I took them out they immediately shrank in the pans and even dipped a bit in the centre (that’s a first - normally they flatten out a bit but not a dip) and started to peel away.
All this points to a structure problem, but I’m not sure where/why….as I go by the recipe in the book and using the Rose Factor I’ve got a chart listing the recipe for all kinds of quantities.
If anyone has any ideas on how to avoid this issue, I’m all ears!

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Posted: 06 September 2008 10:40 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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Welcome to Rose’s forum flourgirl! There has been a lot of discussion on this topic on the blog, click on “Rose’s blog” above and do a search. Also here is a link, read Bill’s comments.

http://www.realbakingwithrose.com/index_ee.php/forums/viewthread/566/

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Posted: 12 March 2010 12:51 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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I am having great difficulty with my cupcake liners peeling away from my mini red velvet cupcakes.  I have tried multiple liners, change the amount of batter, carefully watched the baking time with no luck.  I have read the blogs on this subject and the only posssible answer seems to be to use the creaming method.  Unfortunately, that is the method I am using with this recipe.  They especially pulled apart after they had cooled and I wrapped them tightly to be icing the next day.  It was obvious that the tops of the cakes were more moist the following day than the day I baked them.  I am assuming the liners are absorbing the moisture.  Do I dare reduce any of the liquid in the cake?  This is a wonderful, tender cake and hate to start playing with the formula without a clearer understanding of the source of the problem.  Does anyone have any other answers or solutions to this peeling away that looks so tacky?

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Posted: 12 March 2010 08:30 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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flourgirl, I don’t have the magic answer, but I’m wondering, since this happens mostly with your lemon, if the acidity of the batter might be a contributing factor (acidic batters set faster and so these could, in a sense, be overbaking).  Perhaps try leaving out the lemon juice and/or very slightly underbaking them. 

simply delicious, are you using Rose’s red velvet recipe?

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Posted: 12 March 2010 09:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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To answer your question, no I am not using Rose’s red velvet recipe.  The recipe doesn’t have lemon juice in it, but does have white vinegar.  What if I left that out?  Also, I watch these like a hawk when they are baking and take them out as soon as the toothpick is lean and sometimes with even a hint of batter on the tip because of a slight amount of carry over baking.  My other thought is that maybe I should try and switch to either pastry or AP flour, maybe there isn’t enough structure and as they cool they shrink, thus pulling away.  But that doesn’t answer the moisture question that seems to appear the next day after they have set.  Please review and give me your thoughts.  Here is my recipe:

Red Velvet Cake
2-9? cakes

Ingredients

Cake flour         10   oz
Baking soda   0.25   oz
Buttermilk       8   oz
White vinegar   1   T
Vanilla       3   tsp
Eggs, lg         2  
Natural Cocoa powder (not dutch) 2T*    0.35   oz
Butter, unsalted   6   oz
Red food coloring   3   tsp
Sugar, granulated   12.25   oz
Espresso powder   0.25   tsp
Pinch of salt      


Method:

1.  Pre heat to 350?.  Arrange rack in middle of oven. Prep pans. 
2.  Whisk flour, cocoa powder, baking soda, espresso powder and salt in medium bowl.
3.  Whisk buttermilk, vinegar, vanilla, food coloring in large measuring cup.
4.  On medium-high speed, beat butter and sugar till fluffy, scraping sides.
5.  Add eggs and combine thoroughly.
6.  Add 1/3 of flour mixture and beat on medium low until just combined. Add ? of buttermilk mixture and beat on low speed till       combined. Scrape sides of bowl.
7.  Repeat with half of remaining flour mixture, then remainder of buttermilk, followed by remainder of flour mixture.
8.  Pour into pans and bake approximately 25 min.
9.  Fill mini cupcakes with .6 oz (15oz total for a pan of 24) and bake mini cupcakes for 15 min

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Posted: 13 March 2010 08:40 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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sd, I’m not sure about tinkering with your recipe, red velvet generally needs to be a more acidic batter, and if you change the vinegar you’ll also have to change the baking soda (replace with 4x quantity of baking powder) and adjust the salt. 

I do notice with my own baking that cupcakes that are filled a little fuller tend to rise up over the edge of the paper and “grab on”, so that when they shrink, they keep the paper with them.  And overbaked cupcakes shrink more. 

Not sure about the moisture collecting within wrapped cupcakes, are you allowing them to cool completely before wrapping?  I was thinking that perhaps freezing might be better than refrigerating or leaving them at room temp, but it’s just a guess.

Your idea about AP flour sounds interesting, it would absorb more liquid in the batter, not sure if it will address the shrinking issue or not, a small test batch might be helpful.

Perhaps others will chime in with ideas?

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Posted: 13 March 2010 11:48 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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To answer some of your questions, first, yes to letting them cool completely before wrapping.  I even took them out of the tins right out of the oven, which was suggested by a cake shop, to speed up the cooling time and decrease the trapping of any condensation.  The last batch I made, I wrapped tightly with plastic (after they were completely cool) and they sat at room temp overnight.  When unwrapped the next day, boohoo…but about 10 or more liners had pulled away considerably.  As for more batter to grab the liner, that is a good idea.  however, as I recall I was filling to 3/4 full and I could not see the top of the liners when they were baked. 


I really need to understand the"why” of this problem, so I am going to make a test batch using AP flour and will keep you posted.  I really appreciate the feedback.  By the way, I think when I was reading in my Baking Illustrated about a cookie recipe and cake vs. AP, they talked about AP giving providing more structure due to the increase amount of gluten.  So I am thinking, maybe they will keep their height and not shrink as much after coming out of the oven.

Thank you!

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Posted: 13 March 2010 12:50 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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You’re most welcome, though I wish I had had a more definitive answer.  Please report back on your AP flour batch, I’d love to hear how you thought they turned out.

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Posted: 13 March 2010 01:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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Will do.  I just got done reading about Rose’s Red Velvet Cake in her new book and guess what, she is using AP flour!  She warns about making the right conversion from cake to AP.  I am excited to try and hopeful!!  Will keep you tuned in.

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